Re: Road test: Peugeot 307
From: hugo_steincamp (norgo@cybertrails.com)
Date: Fri 22 Mar 2002 - 21:00:44 EST
Con:
As someone who is nutty about French cars (to the point that I've
spent more than $9,000 repairing a 505 that I bought for $1,500 five
years ago), I cannot be fairly accused of rubbishing them. I'd like
to see Peugeot do well in the market place, and it concerns me that
their quality control leaves a lot to be desired. They really will
be scorned by the market place if they continue to turn out new cars
with significant build quality problems. And too many reviews that
I've read of Peugeots (and of Citroens and Renaults for that matter)
complain of things breaking, falling off or not being aligned
properly.
I do not particularly care for Japanese cars as I view them as
characterless appliances rather than automobiles. Nevertheless, I am
impressed with their reliability and build quality. And to say that
Peugeots are more reliable and better built than Japanese cars flies
in the face of every consumer survey that contrasts the reliability
and build quality of different marques. For example, compare list of
problems and recalls of the 306 with the Civic (source Honest John
UK). I have edited out the non mechanical/built quality items (e.g.,
resale value, size of trunk etc)
1993 - 2001 Peugeot 306:
What's Bad
1.8 8-valve XU petrol is the worst engine and many were fitted with
the wrong engine management chip leading to failed emissions tests.
Autobox not recommended. Cambelts and camshaft end seals must be
changed every 3 years and 36,000 miles. Coolant of diesels must be
changed every two years to avoid cylinder head gasket problems. Like
Citroen ZX, can have cat converter test problems. Build quality a
bit 'light'. Clutch cable of RHD cars is routed close to the
exhaust, which dries out the lubrication and prevents the self-
adjuster working properly which leads to premature clutch failure.
Contacts fail in remote keys leading to rapid discharge of batteries.
Reports of failure of rear disc brake callipers. Reports of engine
compartment fuse box short out on diesel almost leading to engine
compartment fires (see Recalls). Spate of conrod failures on R reg
1.9 XUD diesels.
What to Watch Out For
See above. Front suspension bush wear (205s and 306s tend to 'lean'
on the front suspension and are vulnerable to kerb damage. They also
suffer badly from road hump damage). Oil burning petrol engines
needing new valve stem seals (allow £120). Not all diesels have PAS
and all need it. Some reports of fuel line failure on petrol cars,
cured by reinforced pipes. If car has rear discs, check calipers for
fluid leaks. Check for stiff clutch, as cable may need replacing.
Recalls
1995: Check accelerator cable. 1996 (July 1993-February 1996 bulld-
150,000 cars): underbonnet wiring may chafe leading to short circuit
and fire. 1997: possible starter motor fault on 1996 model cars. Free
replacement. 1997 (Feb-May '97 build: 2,060 cars): incorrect brake
compensator fitted. 1998: (Sep '97-Oct '97 BUILD): steering wheel hub
may crack; (Nov '97-Apr '98 build): front suspension may collapse.
May 1999: R reg 1.8 and 2.0 litre petrol engined models recalled for
reinforced fuel lines to be fitted. 2000: 1.9TD October '98 build:
front brake pipes may chafe. All March '98-build 306 models: steering
rack bolts could crack if overtightened during assembly. March '99-
April '99 build 306s with ABS only: possibility of air in brake
fluid. 1/2/2000: possibility that brake servo valve may not operate
correctly resulting in loss of servo assistance. 18,405 cars recalled
for inspection and possible replacement of brake servo valve.
Technical Information Circular No 1555 issued in 2000 re airbag
warning light flashing then remaining on. Remove both front seats,
carry ou repairs to herness connectors, replace seats and clear flaut
from ECU. 3/10/2000: 4,898 306s and Partner vans recalled because of
chance of incorrect machining of front stub axles which could lead to
excessive wear and possibility of lower ball joint collapsing.
Vehicles to be checked and front stub axles to be replaced if
necessary. 2/1/2001: 96 cars were fitted with incorrect LH
driveshafts which could separate from gearbox on a sharp bend or
during excessive suspension deflection. Correct spec driveshafts to
be fitted. 2/1/2001: on 7,853 diesel 306s brake vacuum pump pin may
fail due to excessive wear losing power assistance to brakes.
Replacement pins to be fitted. 2/1/2001: on 2,409 306s possibility
that an open circuit could occur in front seatbelt pretensioner
harness connector leading to flashing of airbag warning light.
Pretensioner harnesses top be replaced. 29/10/2001: 7,593 1.8 16v
306s and 406s recalled for timing belts to be replaced as could fail
before 72,000 mile 'life'. 12/11/2001: Limited recall of 61 306s to
check seatbelt mounting bolts. Late 2001: TSB issued to check all
common-rail to injector unions on HDIs for leaks.
1991 - 1996 Honda Civic:
What's bad
(Nothing mechanical or in terms of build quality)
What to Watch Out For
Needs to have been regularly serviced, preferably with six-monthly
oil changes. VTECs must have clean oil and are particularly
vulnerable to extended service intervals.
Recalls
1994: Honda Civic 3-door, 4-door, CRX automatics: auto gear indicator
may show wrong transmission mode.
You can compare just any Japanese car with any Peugeot at Honest John
UK and the differences in length of the list of problems will be
about the same as that of the 306 vs. the Honda.
Incidentally, I own a 2000 Honda Civic. It has 36,000 miles. Build
quality complaints? The paint chips a bit too easily, there are two
loud buzzing noises in the dash, and the unlock button on the keyless
remoted packed up. That's it. The suspension was a bit noisy at
first, but it's quietened down now. But I'd rather have a 307. The
Honda bores me to sleep and its seats are uncomfortable.
And take my wife (please): She will only ride in my Peugeot on my
birthday; the rest of time she refuses to go near the thing because
it breaks down so much.
Hugo Steincamp
'87 505 STX in the shop
'00 Honda Civic, a.k.a "The Appliance"
--- In peugeot-L@y..., "con" <cengelc@b...> wrote:
> Hugo et al,
>
> I don't understand this obsession with rubbishing French cars (or
anything that's not made in Japan): Is this not a case of "Hell has
no fury like a market scorned"? (apologies to Billy Shakespeare)
>
> Well, let me tell that my wife's choice for a new car was a Toyota
RAV4 (purchased new in 2001). The SUV is full of body rattles which
the dealer claims is either normal or that they (rattles) don't
exist. It seems that this RAV is not exceptionally noisy (other
Australian journalists have also commented on the abnormally high
level of noise from the rattles). What really annoys me is that the
RAV 4's CD player constantly skips tracks when we are driving over
uneven road surfaces; the same roads which my 505 glides over and the
6 year CD player takes in it's stride! You learn to live with
them.
>
> Also, my wife (bless her soul) at every opportunity praises the (18
year old) 505's impeccable road manners, to our friends at every
chance she gets.
>
> My own assesment of the RAV is that it is inherently an unsafe car
and I certainly do not enjoy driving it.
>
>
> Of course, I'm being totally impartial.
>
> con.... 1984 505 STI (Sydney, Australia)
>
>
>
>
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.4 : Fri 22 Mar 2002 - 21:01:04 EST